Now this ain't right. As soon as the 83+ starts rappidly getting programs the 86 gets an emulator. Now this is just another excuse for 86 owners to brag about their calculators. Of course my 83+ can still hold more programs at once then your peoples 86. Of course also there is the fact that the 86 is not flash upgradeable/customizable. watch this emulator cause some more crashes, this emulator may have some bugs in it as well as the fact that ion programs are not perfect. Why doesn't someone just make SOS86 since it has more programs, inculding most ion programs.

Umm, ION86 emulates the TI-83, not the 83+! No one would want to emulate a useless piece of junk like the 83+. Anyways, the 86 has loads more games than the crappy 83+. Also the 86 owns everything, 'cept the 89, maybe...

Wow, you 83+ owners sure are jealouse! I own both an 83+ and an 86, so I dont care... I think the 83+ is great calc, and is superior the 83(has much more mem). Heck, I think theyre all great. Im not going to start saying one calc is better than the other, cause thats just being babyish. :-P

~Jonathan Taylor

Do you think that the 82, 81, 80, and 73 are great? How are they not worse than the other ones?

Yes, cuz they started the whole ti-graphing calculator thing.

~Jonathan Taylor

Actually, the 73, 80, and 82 didn't start the graphing calculator thing. The 81 was TI's first graphing calculator, then the 85, then the 82. The 80's a little newer then the 82, and the 73 is one of the newest.

Im not jellous, Im just stating the fact that if 86'ers have so many more games then the 83 plus or 83, why did anyone did anyone come out with this emulator. Anyone who says that the 83 or 83 plus is a piece of crap really shouldn't use this emulator or have an ION program on their calculator.

On the reply of the comment above this comment that I am repling to I forgot to mention, ION WAS DEVELOPED BECAUSE THE 83+ NEEDED A SHELL DUMBNUT. IF THE 83 PLUS WAS NEVER DEVELOPED, NEITHER WOULD BE ION, AND THEN NEITHER WOULD BE THIS EMULATOR. The 83 plus has a screen raised to the surface, so anyone who calls it a piece of crap and forgets the calculators with an angled screen should get their eyes checked.

If the 83+ were more like the 86 (in terms of not needing a certain shell to run programs) I would get one too.

It doesn't need a shell though. One of the add ons for the 83 plus is the Builtin Assembly capability. The shell just makes it easier for people, people who have trobule with pressing the program buttion and running a basic program or selecting Asm( and pasting a program in.

All TI Graphing calculators except the original 92, 85, 82, 81, 80, and 73(?) have the built-in assembly capability. On all calcs exept the 86, a shell is required because the ASM programs are written for a specific shell. I think that (at least for the 83/83+) this is because the shell extends the ASM support, or something. I do know that the 86 is the only calc where you can run Every Program from the homescreen and not require a kernel, library, or shell. (Except for emulation, but that is different)

Ok, whatever, well I know the newest 82 still needs a shell or a program that can hack assembly.

Actually you are quite right I have the newest TI-82 and it needs a shell to run asm.

The 'original' only applied to the 92, so as to prevent confusion with the 92+. The 'new' 82 is the same as the old 82 except for the casing and buttons.

I have an 82 I'm perfectly proud of it even though it isn't the latest I do know that it does have about 1.4k more memory then the 83 and even more with tyhe 83 plus "not including flash memory". But I look at this discussion here and the so called "86ers" say that their calculator is the best and how the 89 sucks cause it always crashes, but if you ask me the reason why they don't like the 89,82,83,83 plus is because they are to challenged with other calculators besides the 86 and have to use an 86 because it's the only IDIOT PROOF calculator that they can seem to use without it crashing and erasing they memory.

the 86 is one of the least user friendly calculators; I highly doubt that it is "idiot-proof". It took my friend forever to figure out how the menu's work, and he's an idiot :P.

If you know how to use an 86, chances are you have learned enough to use an 82/83(+). TI markets those as the "user-friendly" calculators, since they have easy to use menus; not that efficient, but easy to use none the less.

For your information, the 86 probably crashes more than an 82/83; the 83+ might be it's only competition in that department.

I suggest that everybody PLEASE try out these different calculators before you try to make a point about something you do not understand.

Thankyou

The 86 is a hell of a lot harder to use than the 82.

Partly right... not all "86ers" are bad. Some are kind of stuck up and think their calc is the best (kinda like me with my 89... j/k), but some just can't afford an 89, or only need an 86 for school or something. But you're right the 89 does crash very easily, but it's usually the user's fault. One wrong keypress, and your mem is cleared.

- Jeff

The 86 is a really good calculator, and so is the 89/92+. The only problem with the 89 is you are not allowed to use them on tests/quizes in math except in AP Calculus, mainly because the head of the math department got an 89 for christmas and knows how powerful it is. I still use it for everything in Geometry and during Algebra II when we are not taking tests. That is the main reason that I use my 86 since I got the 89, as well as games. My 89 (HW2 2.03) crashed once when I was rotating a complicated 3D graph on hidden surface mode, which is weird because I thought that the calculaor could't crash unless you ran an ASM program.

Something tells me that 89 rotation is pretty flimsy... I saw on Dim-Ti that rotate("") crashes the 89... which it does. The 89 could really use some better software... and maybe a better shell to help ASM progs not crash the calc so much (although Doors is very well made... just not that stable).

- Jeff

My 89 is very stable when I don't mess with asm.

If I install doors, then it crashes often. It even crashed with 3d graphing.

It has never crashed when doors was not on it.

89 is good, doors tries to do a lot, so it has bunches of buggs.


(Re to another message)
Also, the 86 has a better menuing system than the other calcs (I want it on my 89..)

I think the 86 has a better program editor then the other 8x calcs. I immediatly found the 86 to be an easier to use calc than the 82.

—————————————————————
"The 83 plus has a screen raised to the surface, so anyone who calls it a piece of crap and forgets the calculators with an angled screen should get their eyes checked."
—————————————————————
Actually, the screen on the 83+ is inset into the case by about 2mm.

What is wrong with the slanted screens of the 86, 85, and 82? I personally think that those screens are superior to the screens of the other calcs (except maybe the 92/92+, I've never seen one), because of the protective plastc cover. Because of this cover, the screen is easy to clean and can't get scrached easily. The screen of the 83+ (and the 89) is not good because when dirt, grease and scratches don't come off.

I don't care too much about flat versus angled screens, that is only an opinion and I prefer angled, but it is the protective cover versus the unprotected screen that I care about.

The angled screens go in a little more and are coveredthis makes it a little harder to see. The flat screens may go in a little bit but nothing makes it harder to see, except for dust and fingerprints from people that don't belive in the sacredness of touching the screen. True the sunken screens are protected but as for me, I don't care how delicate it is. I have never droped my calculator. Also, its very easy for me to clean my screen, I just use my electronics cleaning fluid, windex, or a damp cloth and it comes right off, again, I treat all my stuff with care so its no big deal.

shutup, The emulator emulates the 83 verson of ION, most ION games also are avalible for the 83+, Your getting the same games. Anyway if it has lots more games then why do you need ours. Plus I'm an 83 owner as well. Plus you forgot to mention the 92(+), which could kick you 86 out the window anyday. As a matter of fact, isn't the 83+ basically a souped up 83. So anyone who thinks the 83 plus is a piece of crap and the 83 isn't, really needs to compare the features.
Also the point of a calculators superiourty is not how many games are avalible for it but its features and power. the 83 plus has a 2 mhz faster processer then the 83.

Last but not least, at least I can hold all the games, I mean asm programs that the 83+ has avalible at once. The 86, I would guess you can only hold at most 10 crappy games. 5 ok, and 1 good.

etec, you seem to have a problem whenever something good for the TI community happens. You are getting WAY too defensive over a few uneducated comments.

I'm not doubtful you could hold all the games for the 83+ at once; flash memory is a nice thing to have. But please, do not make stupid comments about a calculator you don't even have access to. My 86 has about 10 games, 5 math programs, and 6 other programs as well (such as diamond level editor or asmide86) and I still have about 19k left over.

I have no problem with anything good happening to the ti community. When something good happens to the 83, 82, 83 +, and the 92(+), I have no problem because most of those owners are mature enough to not go in and say that someone elses calculator is a piece of crap. Most 86ers, 85ers, and 89ers come into a board that has nothing to remotely do with their calculator (not like emulation of an 83+/83 shell) and say your calculator is crap. Usually they are the people who treat a calculator as if it were a portable gaming system. And about not having access to, I've used an 86, I asked the owner of it (today) how much ram it has and he told me. It turns out that he had a lot of math stuff stored on it, a lot of vars and stuff. Anyway, If there is something good for the 82 I won't say anything negative, until someone says something like, "the 82 now has this and makes the 83 worthless."

then I apologize for that one comment, and also for some of my fellow 86 peers' comments...

some people just are too quick to judge

I have an 89 and an 83, I usually don't say much negative things unless someone insults me...

Oh and I'm new to my 89... if anyone could tell me how I could force the 89 to give me large decimals I would appreciate it...

Ex:

On my 83: 3/7 returns .4285714286
On my 89: 3/7 returns 3/7

- Jeff

You could do several things:
1) press diamond - enter
2) change 3/7 to (3.)/7 or 3/(7.)
3) put the calc in approx mode instead of exact/auto mode
4) type in approx(3/7) - press F2 and then 5 for approx(]

hmm i have 22 games at last count on my 83+ and i have chapters 1-10 of cliffnotes (without these i would have a lot more memeory but these cliffnotes are a great thing in english class i get to pass them out to all my friends) for the house of seven gables on it right now and i have about 20k ram and 22k flash left on my calc

The 86 has 96k of ram. With an average game size of about 5k (which seems to be about the average), it could hold 19 games and still have a little memory left. When you consider the fact that it can now emulate 3 other calculators, and take the best games from them as well as the best games for the 86 itself, you end up with quite a collection of good games.

it is, I averaged it at about 6.5k

My 86 has about 8k free and it has 17 games, a few math programs, and a shell (YAS) on it.

yeah, everyone says "the 83+ is upgradable..."
hmmm, that's weird, no one that has an 83+ that I've ever met has upgraded theirs !! i'll keep my 89 & 83 thank you.

The new upgrade allows extended battery life for the calculator.

Hmm. Yeah. Right. I'm sure. Whatever.

Like, how?

Ciaran McCreesh
-- etc --

Shutup, and don't say anything. "Like how?" Ask ti, not us. My guess is that it removes battery hogging bugs, makes reseting of the ram on asm programs happen less often, and it also has some more code that enables it to work on low batteries, without corrupting data.

Stop saying shutup. In other words, shutup.

I only said shutup twice dumbass. I say shutup when I want to say shutup see.

shutup
shutup
shutup

I said shutup because they are talking about something that they don't even know about. Anyway, why are you talking.

Ferme ta geulle (Sp?).
Va te faire enc*ler un poulet.

Just calm down and don't get so stressed - girlfriend left you?

Ciaran

No

in order to lose a girlfriend.. you'd have to have one beforehand. ie. Can't lose something you've never had.. Therefore, can't get stressed out about this *loss*

he he...
Rob.
*sorry about this stupid comment dude.. just had to say it.*

I never believe anything ti say. They lie a lot. That is the truth. I bet whatever it is they do won't make a significant difference.

I wasn't trying to be too sarcastic.
Ciaran

Have you ever thought that either they are stupid newbes or that they have no graphlink or that they have no internet connection or that they are just to lazy to upgrade or maby they have the newest verson of the basecode already. I upgraded and mine works better then it did when I first got it. I'll take my flash calculator, thankyou.

"This ain't right"? Heh. WHY THE HELL DO YOU CARE? You're just jealous there isn't some awesome program like this and some AWESOME programmers doing stuff like this for YOUR calculator! Despite the non flash environment, and the less memory (although 96K is PLENTY), the 86 can do a HELL OF A LOT MORE than the 83! It's got the bigger screen and a REAL solver, ability to type in lower case letters, and actual ascii input etc! NEAH!

You forgot to mention the fact that the 86 menu system (and the Custum Menu feature-no custom menu on anything below the 85) is better than the menu system on any other calc (except the 85 which has the same menu system). Although the 89 menus are OK becase of the copy & pase features, the 86 menus are still beter (for many situations)

Why does others suck so much. Let me ask you a queston. On other calculators, can you select the function, can you see the menu, do the menus work, can you access the menu? See, your 86, 85, and 89 have diffrent looks for their menus. Thats all. I operated an 85, I think the shape of it sucks. The screen, you can barely see crap if it were under the clear plastic that covers the LCD. Its as bad as the old 82. I think the 85 should be disposed of. The 86 and 89 arn't so bad, but the 86 has no flash memory. The 89, well I think its a very good calculator, the only thing is that ti is premoting the ti 83 plus more then they are their 68k calculators. My next calculator will be an 89.

Etec, insulting people just because they like a different calc and provide good evidence as why they do isn't very mature.

If you ever took the time to compare both of them, you'd come to a center point in all these facts:

83+:
easier for a first time user
menu's are easier to use
flash mem
less ram
finance package
27 variables
new screen that is flat with the calculator's case
probably crashes less

86:
more functions for a seasoned user
menus are more efficient
no flash memory
most ram of any non flash calc (including the old 92)
can be upgraded by assembly programs (inferential stats, financial programs, asaptrig, etc)
unlimited (roughly speaking) amount of variables
higher resolution screen
TI-85/82/83 emulation available

There you go.

*you forgot flash apps and a few other things.

*No the 83 plus can have unlimited as well, theres some way of putting more than one in one and you can use lists and matrices.

*I didn't mean that comment as an insult to the person. I wanted to get my point across. Every calculator has its advantages and disadvantages.

*You obvously, have never herd what some of theses so called mature people have said about the 83+. let me list them.

- your calculator is crap
- the 83 plus crashes too much cause it sucks
- i would never buy that calculator
- still the <another model> has <someting>
- all 83+ owners are newbes
- my calculator can kick your calculators $@# any day
- the 83 plus should be <blown up, destroyed, stabbed,etc>
- die 83 plus
- why do people make programs for that crappy calc

want more, request them. This pisses me off that as soon as a calculator evolves from a beta stage people insult the owners. Why don't you pick on them and not on me.

I have used the 82, 83+, 85, 86, and 89. I own the 86 & 89 and frequently use my friend's 83+ to put games on it. I have written programs on all of those calculators, and the 86(85) are, in my opinion, the easiest to program for because of their menu system. They are the only calculators where the menu stays open after you select a menu item, which makes repeated tasks a lot easier. The ability to type commands in if you don't know where to find them also makes programming easier, and the custom menu makes frequently used calc functions easier to use. I think that the 83+ is the best calc in its class, and its class contains the 82, 83, and 83+ calcs. I see no reason for anyone to get the 82 or 83. However, the ONLY advantage over the other calcs is that it has FLASH ROM, which in turn means a lot of mem and crash protection, although every once in a while games will just disappear from the calc and I have to put the games back on. So, I think that the 83+ is an OK calculator--there is nothing WRONG with it, it just isn't as good as some other calcs. Sometimes I actually consider getting one so that when people at school with 83+s want games, I won't have to take them home.

The 83+ *is* crap. The quality of your calculator isn't even remotely connected to anyone's maturity. The 86 may not be as good as the 89, but it sure kicks the hell out of the 83, plus or otherwise.

HEY EVERYBODY, LOOK, JACKASS JUST PROVOKED ME AGAIN. GO F$&# A COW, THE NO CALCULATOR IS CRAP, CRAP WAS TAKEN FROM THE TERM CRUD, CRUD WAS TAKEN FROM DRY MESS ON SOMETHING. THE TI 83+ WAS NOT TAKEN OFF A WINDSHIELD. SOME PEOPLE MAKE ME SICK, AFTER I FOR ONCE CAME ON TO TICALC IN A GOOD MOOD, LUNKHEAD HAD TO PROVOKE ME, YOU ARE CRAP IKECAM. IT TURNS OUT THAT YOU SHOULD GET YOUR POSTING PRIVLIGES TAKEN AWAY FROM YOU. THE 83+ HAPPENS TO BE A "HIGH QUALITY PRODUCT," SO DON'T USE THAT ARGUMENT. GREAT, NOW EVERYTIME I SEE YOUR NAME I'LL INSULT YOU.

Calm down a bit.

Actually, "crap" comes from the name Thomas Crapper. I hear he owned an 83+.

Like Ciaran said, you deffinately need to calm down a bit. We're talking about calculators, which, last time I checked, wasn't a huge, all important subject about which we should get worked up. There is no need to get offended on behalf of your graphing device.

This is 'Sir' Thomas Crapper (the 'Sir' is a sarcastic thing again) who invented the toilet, just like Shakespear write Romeo and Juliette (sp?).

Ciaran

Now I remember that, thanks for reminding me about that part of history.

I get offended at the disgustingness of people saying a calculator is crap for no reason, same with people saying the same thing about a macintosh, only with the mac, I'm a loyal fan of Apple, so its a little more personal there.

People have a reasons for calling the 83+ crap, they also have reasons for calling the mac crap. The original reason (I think) that people called the 83+ crap is because there weren't any games and people were demanding games, or something. That is also (in my opinion) the reason that a mac is not a good system: there are no (well, maybe a couple) good games! (the other thing with macs is most people are introduced to them at school and therefore don't like them. I might have a LITTLE more respect for macs if I didn't first use them at school.

But that said, the 83+ is (in my opinion) only worth getting if you are VERY pressed for money. If you (or your parents) can afford an 83+, you can probably afford the much more worthwhile TI-86. The 86 is more advanced than the 83+ (except for the FLASH ROM), just like the 89 is more advanced than the 86, no arguments. Heck, the 89 is more advanced than all the other calcs - 92+ excluded - combined! (by more advanced, I mean math capabilites, not games. If more advanced applied to games, the 86 would be at the top.)

The mac, you might have a little more respect for the mac if you first used its true interface. Schools put that crap called At Ease on it that makes the system as unstable as Windows and Put the crap called Netscape on most of them too. I HATE windows, Microsoft products have a high quality most of the time, but once they got to windows 98, they turned their os into crap, windows nt 4.0 is good, but from what I here of Windows 2000 is that it is supposed to be worse then windows 98.

In my opinion the 83+ is worth getting when that is the most advanced calculator my school can teach you everything about. The 83+ is also good if you want an very good calculator for a cheaper price. Calculators with flash upgradability are much more expandable then the ones that don't.

Also in my opinion, Most PCs=crap. All macintoshes=quality, support, endless features, better resolution, and for the games it has, a very good gaming machine. Most here have never seen the true power of the most advanced Mac in stores. Hey, the mac os kernal is very good, the only disadvantage for lazy people is that there is no start menu. Some people are too lazy to navigate through your hard drive or create atlases(shortcuts for the mac illiterit) on your desktop, plus the trash can makes more sence over a recycling bin that works more like a trash can.

Actually, I think that I didn't use At Ease the first time I used a mac, I used the mac os with the stupid Foolproof security system. They were also old macs, not any faster (or maybe slower) than my old 386 system (and they all have stupid 1-button mice). Now that I am in high school, however, the macs have at ease on them, and at ease one of the stupidest things in the world.

"- All 83 plus owners are newbies"

Thank you. I've been waiting for someone to say that... not only are most of them newbies, but they are real game beggars too... you can see from some of the reply boards on this site. They get pissed that they don't have games, and bug someone to port it, but they don't appreciate the hard work and time that programmers put into their games.

Yeah they are game beggars! This one kid in my math class kept asking me for games and I told him that I have an 89, not an 83+. Then the next day he says, I just bought a Graphlink, can you show me how to use it? I was like, what the heck, you need to be at a computer for it to work dumbnutz. Anyways as it goes on, I finally said, goto ticalc.org and look for games. He did, and put them on his calc, with ION, ofcourse. He crashed it as usual. Then he put the same frikin program that crashed it, on the calc again! AND AGAIN HE CRASHED IT! Therefore I believe the stability of a calc greatly depends on the user of it, and "ofcourse" the program version and if it has any bugs in it. I cannot believe how many people have not read the readme file and just put the game on their calc. Anyways, those are my two sense on this whole section of misunderstanding, well, you call it what you want....

-akromix "Coppermine 500E RULES!!! Got mine to 750Mhz!"

First of all not all 83/+ users are game beggers. Yes I am new to the ticalc "scene" i got my 83+ about half a year ago, during this time i have never begged or even asked for a game, instead i went online and checked out everything related to my calc. I educated myself about my calculator (and see that i should have done that earlier because otherwise i would have bought an 86), and i can say now that i pretty much fully understand my calc (even if I am pretty much the only one in school who does) and i even look into learning assembly now. I guess my point is that being a newbie doesn't automatically make you an idiot who doesn't appreciate the work of others and only "wants, wants, wants"

Then you're one of the 3l33t few... and thank you... most 83+ owners are poisoning the TI community with their begging and stupidity.

I would have also... but for lack of anything to do over a couple days last summer, I read my TI manual cover-to-cover, then I came here and learned more... while most of my friends are trying to figure out how to graph a line.

I have experience with the 83 and I am one of those that say "A calculator is a tool, not a gameboy." I *was* always tired of the game beggers, I let games die out in my school.

Etec What are you talking about??? I own an 82, 83+, and an 86! I have owned TI calcs for 3 years! Stop insulting evrything about the 83+. It is stable, but yes the 86 is better! If anything I think the Ti-Calc staff should take posting prilages away from you! All you do is insult peeps!

I would insult you for what you said but I am just going to say, go back to my comment and read carefully, I said thats what others say. I see nothing wrong with the calculators, I just hate the people who say something sucks when they don't even know about it.

What about the people who say something sucks when they DO know about it, and HAVE used it, and even written Programs on it?
The 86 is much better than the 83+, except for the FLASH ROM. I speak from personal experiences using both calcs.

I say the all calculators are good. The 83+ happens to be the most insulted just because its new. And if you make quick math programs and have a bad memory, you don't have to try and remember every command and how to spell it, like getKey. Capatal K. Also usually people say it is crap because they are game beggers. If it doesn't have that many games it sucks to them. If the 92 had no games some people would say it sucks even though it is the King of all Calculators.

If you don't remeber how to spell it you don't have to: you find it in the menu or the catalog. Also, if you find in a menu or put it in the custom menu, you can enter it repeatedly.
For example, I was writing a math program for a friend (on the 83+), and scince I like to clean up, I write programs so that they delete any variables used during the program. So, I needed to use the DelVar( command a bunch of times, and it is REALLY annoying to have to go into the menu and then find the delvar( command or even after a few times just press alpha-g (or something) in the menu EACH time I needed to use that command! I had at least 10 variables to delete. On the 86, I just go into the CTL (program editor) menu, press [more][more][more] [F1], then the variable, next line: [F1] then the variable, ect... It is much more efficient, and the ABILITY to type commands in is good if you know the command.

whatever, I give up, I can't get some of you to see a good side to the 83+, most just see disadvantages.

I'm not jellous because I don't want games from other calculators. I, unlike pethetic people, don't treat my calculator as a gameboy. I treat it more as a low powered portable computer. That little ram it has is not enough for a developer (me). I need flash to protect my programs. Real solver? ohh, I figured out the solver as soon as I got it. Humm, I wonder why I can calculate as 27 varables using my solver. Think before you speek. Of course some people with the intellegence of an orange can't figure it out, the same people who say a game sucks where you need to think because they can't beat the first level. Bigger screen, I think you mean sharper screen idiot. I don't care, again there is no advantage to me having better resolution, If you install a secondary z80 processer, heck you could put in an active matrax screen. Lowercase, I can use an ION program for that or a flash app to enable it. TI simply disabled it becaues some people might have trouble understanding it. ascii input, again, why the hell would I care, I can learn hex and do all I want with my 83 plus that involves non-basic functions. I'll stop here

While I could repeat all this, I'll just stick with saying "You're right!!".

--Robin Kay--

actually, I think the screen is both bigger and sharper (I've looked at a friends 83 before).

Not to start another calc war, but here goes:

While 96k of RAM is small, it's still enough for periodic tables and storing a lot of formula programs also.

the 86 has more than 27 variables (each one can have up to 8 letters as its name), thus you can do more variables in the 86's solver than the 83 (I think, I've never tried the 83's, didn't know it had one).

Insulting people because of a calculator doesn't make you any better than those who think they're merely gameboys.

There is an advantage to better screen resolution: you get to see more. Which would you rather view your desktop as, 640x480 or 800x600?

I don't understand your sentence about a secondary z80 processor...

Lowercase is much easier to use when you don't have to run an assembly/flash program to obtain it.

TI wouldn't disable lowercase because people wouldn't understand it. I think TI has a LITTLE more faith in its customers :P

You can also learn how to do all you want for an 86 that involves non-basic functions, too.

While 96k of RAM is small, it's still enough for periodic tables and storing a lot of formula programs also.

>I agree

the 86 has more than 27 variables (each one can have up to 8 letters as its name), thus you can do more variables in the 86's solver than the 83 (I think, I've never tried the 83's, didn't know it had one).

>83 can use other methods of storing values than just the alphabet

Insulting people because of a calculator doesn't make you any better than those who think they're merely gameboys.

>I only insult those who provoke me, the only reason this happened was because I stated my opinion that says that I feel its not fair that the 83+ doesn't even have an emulator to emulate its closest family member, the 83.

There is an advantage to better screen resolution: you get to see more. Which would you rather view your desktop as, 640x480 or 800x600?

>I actually like mine at 1024x728, this is a calculator were talking about, why do you need an better resolution for that. A computer (most) have a multi-tasking operating system, where you need to have space to see everything. I have 7 windows open right now. A calculator is not like that, the only thing better about high resolution for a calculator are games, or in the 92 calculators, the menus.

I don't understand your sentence about a secondary z80 processor...

> a secondary z80 processer gives the 85 or lower model number the power to operate a more advanced screen, optimally.

Lowercase is much easier to use when you don't have to run an assembly/flash program to obtain it.

>Once you run the program or change the options, you can delete the program. Its better because you have an option.

TI wouldn't disable lowercase because people wouldn't understand it. I think TI has a LITTLE more faith in its customers :P

>Well they did, but to make the ti 83+ simpiler, the reason the code is even in there is so the system can display it without using assembly.

You can also learn how to do all you want for an 86 that involves non-basic functions, too.

>I agree, I am just saying that the 83+ is only limited to the owners or programers capabilities.

There isn't much reason for an 83 emulator on the 83+, becasue most of the games for the 83+ and the 83 are the SAME!

I don't know about other people, but I don't understand the whole secondary processor / more powerful LCD thing.

The higher resolution of the 86/85, 89, and 92/92+ enables you to fit more text, see longer answers without having to scroll, more detailed graphs and makes numbers / letters easier to read.

I don't understand where you say that having to use an asm program to get lowercase letters is better because you have an option. If you don't want to use lowercase letters on the 86, you don't have to.

In my school it would be because 83+ owners want access to the vast library of SOS games... maybe that would stop some of the swearing at me when I say "No, these games are for SOS, you have an 83+... you can't have them."

- Jeff

the 83 has more programs

secondary processer/better screen, is technical, I would suggest that many people don't try and figure this out, most people don't understand how much of the resources a better screen uses.

ok, high resolution is a good think to have, but I don't need it.

lowercase, the fact that somepeople are too stupid to figure it out makes it easier on the 83+ (no offence)

I know that a better (higher res, sharper, physically larger) screen uses a lot of resources, but what does having a second processor (which I understand how it would enable a calc to do more) have to do with anything? You don't need a second processor to have a better screen, take the 86 or even the 89/92(+) as an example.

Those calculators have better enhanced processers that can support better screens, you could replace the processer but then your asm programs wouldn't work. A second z80 is the solution, and if you give it 1k of ram you won't loose user ram. Notice the low rez z80s can't go perfect greystyle, thats because their z80s are diffrent.

Dude.. I'm serious.. you DON'T know what you're talking about. ASCII input is where you can type in a command, for instance, Graph( and once you hit enter it finds the token for it and replaces it with that (if you even know what that means mister smart guy).. On the 83, you have to find it in a menu and do it. AND, what I meant about a REAL solver, is the 86 does REAL solving. The 83/+ only does 0=[equ], which SUCKS. Oh, and, btw, the 86 can do more than 27 variables. I never said the 83 sucked... I said that you shouldn't be dissin the GOOD programmers that are making GOOD programs for the 86 and you getting all mad when it DOESN'T EVEN CONCERN YOU. now SHUT UP

How does the 86 solver work? I was real pissed at how much the 83 solver sux when I got it...

- Jeff

it doesn't suck its just harder to use

You can do stuff like 3x=5, or 3x^2=4x^3, and stuff like that

You tell it a formula and the values of all but one of the variables. Then, it solves for the last one. It's not nearly as useful as the simul and polynomial solvers, though.

The [SIMULT] and [POLY] built-in functions are the best! They are better (well, almost) than the ones on the 89 because the 89 doesn't have them! For the poly function, it is actually better on the 89 (the solve( fuction), but the simult is annoying to use matrices, it should have an application, like (or instead of) the numerical solver.

I know what ASCII means I thought you said another term that has a similar spelling, don't look for it too many people might have a seasure, thats why I won't mention it. I don't mind looking for it in menus, Its actually faster using menus if you know where it is (like me).

The 83s solver is perfectly fine, its not that hard to enter it in more as a check step then the actual equation, it works perfectly fine for me, I don't know what people classify it as a sucky solver when it works with a diffrent method but does the same thing.

I never said it can't do more then 27 variables, the 83 can too, if you know how.

I don't mean to disrespect good programers for the 86, I'm only saying that, why can't these calculators stay with their native language, I'm sure ti would agree.

And it does concern me, that "This aint fair" statement was a joke, if you wern't a nerd, you could figure that out. So now you shut the hell up before you say something stupid, wait you already did. Damm, nobody understands that I got mad from the insulting of the 83, me, and the stupidity in this message board.

Speaking of nerds, you're getting pissed at everyone over YOUR CALCULATOR. Many of us think that the 83+ is inferior to the 86. You can disagree, but there is really no need to get all worked up about it.

I get worked up when it seems like everyone on this board doesn't have an open mind. Speaking of nerds, only nerds say the mac, aol, and anything that is better/easier sucks. And if I'm such a nerd how come your the one judging people before you see a good side. Ask anyone I've helped before with technical problems, they'll say I give thurow instructions. I spend time just to help someone I don't even know. Strange, I should check your email address, that way I can deny permission of help.

dumbass all you can solve is things that equal zero.. and you're the nerd because you know where EVERYTHING is in EVERY menu...

Look in the back of your manual. There's a big chart of where the commands are in the menus. Very helpful for when you're programming ^_^

-nik, who owns a 83+ but would rather have an HP49

dumbass from the dumbass and dumbass corperation, try translating 5x+B=3d+5 to 0=(5x+B)-(3d+5) and enter it into the solver, you'll get the right answer, if you study it you'll see how it works. Also I don't know everything in every menu. Because I program, I learned most of the functions. Also knowing a lot about a subject doesn't make you a nerd. If you are a nerd, like some on this board, you probly have no life, you try and prove everyone wrong, and people hate you. If you have ever seen somebody say, "look its snowing outside," and pop up in their conversation and say "NO, ACTUALLY THATS CALLED SLEAT, SNOW HAS <some characteristic> and sleet has <some other characteristic>. You are probly a nerd. When someone says that its a laptop, I don't say, that no its really a <some name, eg. Power>Book.